RP Advice

[Jumwa]

I know this has been a topic before in the past, but it bears repeating, especially from another source! : D

http://www.giantitp.com/articles/tll307KmEm4H9k6efFP.html

Of interest, the second half:

Have you ever had a party break down into fighting over the actions of one of their members? Has a character ever threatened repeatedly to leave the party? Often, intraparty fighting boils down to one player declaring, "That's how my character would react." Heck, often you'll be the one saying it; it's a common reaction when alignments or codes of ethics clash.

However, it also creates a logjam where neither side wants to back down. The key to resolving this problem is to decide to react differently. You are not your character, and your character is not a separate entity with reactions that you cannot control. I can't tell you how many times I've heard a player state that their character's actions are not under their control. Every decision your character makes is your decision first. It is possible and even preferable for you to craft a personality that is consistent but also accommodating of the characters the other players wish to play.

When you think about a situation, ask yourself, "Is this the only way my character can react to this?" Chances are, the answer is, "No." Try to refine your character so that you can deal with situations that conflict with your alignment/ethos without resorting to ultimatums, threats, etc. This will often mean thinking in terms of compromise and concession to your fellow players, or at the very least an agreement to disagree.

Here's another example: In a campaign I DM'd, the party's bard lifted a magical sword behind the back of the party's Lawful Good monk. The monk had basically decided that the bodies of several fallen knights would be buried without looting, and rather than argue, the bard just grabbed the sword. The bad news was, the sword was cursed; it was the blade that had belonged to a ghost that roamed the castle, and whenever the bard drew it, the ghost materialized and attacked him (and only him). Eventually, the bard 'fessed up that he had stolen the sword. The monk (and the monk's player) became furious, and declared that he could no longer travel with the bard. Either the bard had to leave, or he would. It became a huge argument between characters and players, and it was entirely unnecessary. The monk did not have to react with an ultimatum; the monk did not even have to be angry, no matter what his alignment was. The bard had already suffered the misfortune of having his Charisma drained by the ghost repeatedly; the monk could have chosen (for example) to lecture the bard on how his theft had brought him nothing but misery. He chose to create player conflict when it was just as easy to not.

Personally, I blame the paladin for this. The original paladin class created the precedent for one player thinking he has the right to dictate the morality of other players. That drives me nuts. Ever since, players who select a Lawful Good character automatically assume it is up to them to police the rest of the party, and too often, the rest of the party lets them. As far as I'm concerned, no player has the right to tell another player how to act. Lawful Good is not the "right" way to be, and it is unacceptable to push your character's ideals on other players whether they want them or not.

Another useful application of this concept involves accepting story hooks your DM gives to you. Try to never just say, "My character isn't interested in that adventure." A lot of people mistake this for good roleplaying, because you are asserting your character's personality. Wrong. Good roleplaying should never bring the game to a screeching halt. One of your jobs as a player is to come up with a reason why your character would be interested in a plot. After all, your personality is entirely in your hands, not the DM's. Come up with a reason why the adventure (or the reward) might appeal to you, no matter how esoteric or roundabout the reasoning.

If the paladin is to blame for the last problem, this one belongs to the druid. Druids have such a specific set of principles that players often mistake them for being a free pass to demand that each adventure revolve around their goals. Raiding a dungeon for gold doesn't appeal to the druid mindset, so what are you to do if you play one and are presented with that goal? You improvise. Maybe the gold will enable you to purchase magic items that will let you protect the wilderness. Maybe the ruins contain unnatural monsters that need to be killed regardless of the treasure. Maybe, just maybe, the other PCs are your friends and you are willing to help them just because. Too often that last part is forgotten; I don't think anyone reading this has never spent the night doing something they'd rather not because a friend asked.

So if you're really paying attention, you may be thinking, "Hey, don't those two points contradict one another? First he says to separate what your character thinks from what you think, but then he says your character doesn't have its own reactions." Well, no. Separate your character's thoughts from your own thoughts, but don't forget who is in control of both personalities. The division between your personality and that of your character only goes so far as it helps the game; once it begins becoming a disruption, a player has a responsibility to alter his or her character's decisions in the interest of the group. In the end, your relationships with the people you are sitting in someone's living room with are more important than your character's internal consistency.

[Sindiralia / Elloka]

I love this!! Compromise FTW.  Better to come up with a random ass reason and go with it so you have a good time instead of making yourself sit something out because of your character's "set" personality.  Be flexible people!

[Jumwa]

Oh, and thanks to Azbrotriz for pointing out the link to me!

I love this!! Compromise FTW.  Better to come up with a random ass reason and go with it so you have a good time instead of making yourself sit something out because of your character's "set" personality.  Be flexible people!

The amount of times I have to compromise for the sake of the greater enjoyment of Tribe members... a daily occurrence really.  But what would be the point of my investing all this time and energy into creating and running a guild--the sole reason for said guilds existence is to provide entertainment for its members--if I just ended up refusing to do anything but stubbornly insist on ruining all the fun?

[Vinjura]

Yay for good advice! though suddenly I have the urge toi have a go at Dungions and Dragons, even though I have never played it before :x

[Bezaid]

Yay for good advice! though suddenly I have the urge toi have a go at Dungions and Dragons, even though I have never played it before :x

If I had Skype, I'd offer to hook you up with the game we're having this Saturday. As I do not, sadly, I can only direct you to http://www.meetup.com/ and suggest you find pen and paper entertainment near you!

Also, I seem to recall having read through that article when looking for RP ideas for a character in the past. Very helpful, thanks for posting it here!

[Azmotriz]

Also, I seem to recall having read through that article when looking for RP ideas for a character in the past. Very helpful, thanks for posting it here!

Yep. <3 GITP Games.

[Uunruk]

Yay for good advice! though suddenly I have the urge toi have a go at Dungions and Dragons, even though I have never played it before :x

If I had Skype, I'd offer to hook you up with the game we're having this Saturday. As I do not, sadly, I can only direct you to http://www.meetup.com/ and suggest you find pen and paper entertainment near you!

Also, I seem to recall having read through that article when looking for RP ideas for a character in the past. Very helpful, thanks for posting it here!

I play a pen & paper game pretty much every Saturday. It's fun times for sure.

[Junza]

I agree, its always fun to compromise when you can, plus it tends to lead to some fun adventures.

[Jumwa]

To take the concept to a larger perspective:

The Burning Tusk Tribe started off as an orc and troll only guild.  We remained that way for a few months, before finally beginning to change and bringing in tauren, then eventually forsaken and blood elves (after Burning Crusade launched).  For this, we've been berated by other RPers for "compromising" our RP repeatedly, even to this day, when race restriction is a relatively ancient thing for BTT, vastly eclipsed by our years without race exclusion.

Putting aside the fact that, as initial creative conceptualizer of the Tribe, it was my original intent that over time we would open the doors to other races (or move on to another guild project), what fun would it be--in the long run-- to close ourselves off from most other RPers entirely?  To cut off friends we care for and want to spend time with over rather arbitrary avatar choices?  

The allure of RPing a racist troll who refuses to associate with disgusting elves and those icky undead zombies we call Forsaken is pretty great.  To chit chat in a language others can't understand, seems sorta cool on a level.  But these things are fleeting feelings if you plan against character development that leads you away from such behaviour.  Before long you're just an obstinate fool whose only satisfaction from the act of cutting yourself off from others is the self-assurances of how great you are for doing it.  You're not a great RPer for it, you're a somewhat lonely RPer being obstinate for obstinancies sake and refusing the potential for character development--which, I might dare to venture, makes you less of a skilled RPer.

Only boring characters--and by extension guilds--come out fully formed and totally resistant to development and change.  Playing the same character without change for years is not RP to me.

[Uunruk]

Only boring characters--and by extension guilds--come out fully formed and totally resistant to development and change.  Playing the same character without change for years is not RP to me.

None of my characters ever change, and I'm a fantastic roleplayer. You're just doing it wrong.

I mean, just look at Uunruk. He's never chan... oh wait... never mind.

[Anjasa]

If the Tribe didn't change, Anjasa wouldn't be Chieftess

[Jumwa]

If the Tribe didn't change, Anjasa wouldn't be Chieftess

Or a member.

The changes the Tribe has undergone took years of roleplaying, long plots involving the membership that evolved over time, and were never really planned fully.  I never tried to manipulate and force the direction of the Tribe, but only worked from the IC angle as events transpired. 

[Jumwa]

To clarify:

All the race acceptance changes were done and decided upon IC, voted upon as well.  No action was taken with less than overwhelming support on that front.  Though that doesn't mean IC that certain leaders *Cough* Jumwa *Cough* didn't exploit circumstances and events to gain favourable support.  But that's politics for you.

[Azmotriz]

We kind of attracted a different crowd in our early days with the race exclusion thing, too, on a somewhat related note. We got a lot more members who were OOCly neurotic about blood elf players and genuinely believed there was something wrong with people who play elves. From there, it's less along the lines of a character being true to the roots for those players and more that they were just a medium to burn people who play 'pretty' characters based on something unresolved OOCly. (On another tangentially note we were a bit less strict about our members' behavior back then)

Not to say the whole guild was like that, but it ended up a rather vocal portion where the hatred wasn't just IC and they were very resistant on both IC and OOC terms to the guild accepting the other races. But yeah, changing that rule was certainly one of the best things we did for the guild's RP. We attracted a lot of naysayers over it who were mad about the guild changing, but fuck that and fuck them.

[Jumwa]

To be fair, all the nay saying was from outside the Tribe from people who didn't really RP anyhow.  RPers who don't actually RP seem to be the ones with the loudest opinions on what makes for good and bad RP.